It’s been long noticed that they have more holidays than most other countries (and it’s not that they work longer hours the rest of the year; from what I’ve heard from people who’ve lived there, they’re like the Swiss – if you go to a German shop just as they’re closing, they’ll tell you to come back tomorrow, not interested in making one more sale for the day), yet they manage to have not only a first-world economy, but remain constantly in the top tier (they’re always there at a G7 or G8 or G20 conference or whatever it is these days).
I am a Calvinist, but that notwithstanding, I sure as hell see no point in glorifying the ‘Protestant work ethic‘ (or ‘Calvinist work ethic’ or ‘Puritan work ethic’, as it’s variously known), if a country / culture that doesn’t subscribe to it can nevertheless be successful; what’s the point of having less holidays, being overworked, if you can still be competitive with more holidays and a more laid-back attitude in general? I can’t find any online examples at the moment, but from what I have read of Chesterton, one of my favourite Catholic writers, he pooh-poohed the Protestant work ethic, and delighted in people not taking work too too seriously; you do what you have to, but don’t overdo it, and take time to enjoy the company of your co-workers, etc. Hey, why not? And why not have more days off, if it’ll recharge your batteries and make you more productive when you’re on the job? Makes sense to me.
Ditto the practice in Spain and Spanish-speaking countries of ‘siesta‘ (also done in a few southern regions of France, I understand, called ‘sieste‘ there, of course); why not, when it’s the hottest time of day outside, take a break, and come back after a nap? (Not to mention the best way to deal with postprandial narcosis, which regardless of climate, afflicts many around 2:00 pm or so.) Also makes sense to me!
Work is a good thing, certainly. But it’s not the end-all, be-all, of existence. We work to live, certainly; but we shouldn’t live to work. Hard work is a result of the Fall, remember; we shall rest from our labours permanently in the life of the world to come, same as we do on Sundays, and when we retire…
I say, good on the Germans, for their many holidays AND successful economic performance in spite of such. Deutschland über alles!
beta_plus
March 23, 2012 at 12:38 am
Germany is not nice because of its legal structure, holidays, and social welfare.
Germany is nice because it is full of Germans.
Prinz Eugen
March 23, 2012 at 1:05 am
Having lived and worked there I totally agree. Like the choirs of angels, every nation has some corresponding virtues innate to it as well as vices unique to it. The Germans are probably the best example of this.
idrian
March 23, 2012 at 3:10 am
What do you think is responsible for all this? I tend to think now that perhaps the Germans put out all their effort and skill in whatever they do in the short amount of time.
Will S.
March 23, 2012 at 6:05 am
@ bp: Okay, but why not both?
@ PE: Agreed, certainly.
@idrian: Yeah, that’s probably it. But they seem to have a recognition of the value of ‘down-time’ that many other cultures lack.
ccarnivore
March 23, 2012 at 7:22 am
Don’t forget, that the former Communist East Germany had the best economy behind the Iron Curtain. It was said, if anyone could get communism to work, it would be the Germans.
Germany has a large social safety net, but they don’t feed the military/industrial complex nearly to the extent the US does. In the end, though, their system is also not sustainable. Insufficient young to replace the old.
Will S.
March 23, 2012 at 10:07 am
Ah. Yeah, not spending as much on the military does have an impact, economically…
“In the end, though, their system is also not sustainable. Insufficient young to replace the old.”
Hence the Turkish gastarbeiter, I take it…
Svar
March 23, 2012 at 4:16 pm
Prinz Eugen, I’m curious to hear what the virtues and vices of the Germans are.
Southern Man
March 23, 2012 at 8:31 pm
Don’t overestimate the Germans. Their economy relative to the rest of the EU is a bit like comparing them to the “garden spot of Ceti Alpha VI.”
Will S.
March 24, 2012 at 8:15 am
Ha! 🙂
Fine, but aren’t they doing something right, having great quality of life for their people, as well as a decent enough first-world economy? I think they are.
electricangel1978
March 25, 2012 at 11:26 pm
Will,
Read The Overworked American. written in the late 80s, the theme is that the US could have had the same standard of living it had I 1948 working half the hours, but people instead chose to work MORE. scary.
One fact from the book: one impetus for the Protestant “Reformation” was the great number of non-working days. medieval serfs had 1/3 of days dedicated to feasting and saints days. You Prots put an end to THAt, right quick.
Will S.
March 26, 2012 at 12:13 am
Maybe I should be a Lutheran, instead; they’re closer to Rome in laid-back-ness about things, than us Calvinists… 😉
Will S.
March 26, 2012 at 12:14 am
Which is probably why the half-Lutheran, half-Catholic nation of Germany is as it is, rather than the more thorough-going Protestants of further north in Europe and their colonial descendents…
Will S.
March 26, 2012 at 1:19 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17489035
Svar
March 26, 2012 at 9:55 am
It seems that God wanted us to work only 2/3s of the year and to drink alcohol but you Prots…. It seems that you like to disobey God only when He wants you to have fun.
Will S.
March 26, 2012 at 10:29 am
A pair of pillowcases from 19th-century, heavily Methodist, Upper Canada:
Will S.
March 26, 2012 at 3:11 pm
Here’s a fun site for anyone who wishes they could be insulted by Luther:
http://ergofabulous.org/luther/
AJ
March 27, 2012 at 12:00 am
No man has ever lain on his death bed and wished that he could’ve worked harder or spent more time at the office.
We work… but God provides.
Will S.
March 27, 2012 at 12:40 am
Exactly, AJ. 🙂
Alte
March 27, 2012 at 8:53 pm
Is this topic bait for me?
Germany is nice because it’s full of Germans. They are very efficient workers, so they don’t have to work as many hours in total in order to produce the same amount, with better quality at a slightly higher cost. There’s a reason why they keep trying to take over all of Europe, with mixed success: they can. Like the other Germanic countries, things just seem to work there. Hardly anything ever breaks down, nobody is late, everything is has its place.
But they need more babies. And they have a sort of autistic-bent, so they can be rather robotic and blunt. But I think it’s the latter that makes them such good workers.
Will S.
March 27, 2012 at 9:00 pm
Hey Alte, welcome to Patriactionary!
No, it wasn’t bait, but glad to have your perspective on this. 🙂
So, Germans work hard during their work hours, rather than slacking off / goofing off a good chunk of the time, unlike North American workers with an internet connection? 😉
Makes sense.
What about the gastarbeiters? Is it the case, like with North Americans, that there are just some jobs ordinary Germans won’t do, so they need to find foreigners to fill them? I presume that must be it. Or is it that Germans won’t do them at rates that are competitive enough, but Turks will?
Alte
March 27, 2012 at 11:25 pm
Both, I think.
Will S.
March 27, 2012 at 11:28 pm
Ah.
MW
March 28, 2012 at 2:11 am
Will, you could do waaay worse that becoming a Lutheran…. Stick with LCMS, or WELS. The ELCA is doctrinally drowning in liberalism.
As my best friend, a Lutheran pastor, always tells people… come on back, the door’s wide open, the grass is green, the beer’s cold and our Saviour has won us our freedom, once, for all.
And on the subject of Germans and ALte and Bavaria and Lent,
http://www.thestar.com/living/food/article/953751–man-to-live-on-beer-alone-for-lent
Will S.
March 28, 2012 at 7:22 am
Hey, MW. I’m happy in the Reformed faith, but I like a lot of things about confessional Lutheranism; it has a lot in common with the Reformed way, including love of beer (well, there are some elements in the Reformed community who eschew alcohol, but those of us who don’t, make up for them). 😉
Amusing story, that. Good for him! 🙂
MaMu1977
April 6, 2012 at 4:41 pm
As someone who lived in rural Germany for three years, I took note of one German practice that guaranteed it a permanent place in my heart: Germans aren’t *visibly* money hungry.
I’m assuming that the massive amounts of arable (and harnessable, for energy’s sake) land and abundant resources have much to do with their generosity, but I was astonished at the (comparably) lower pricing scales, higher quality and willingness to share of the “low country” Germans with whom I lived for my time in their nation. I’ve never enjoyed as many “free” beers, grade A steaks (beef, pork, turkey, etc.), near-wholesale consumer goods or languid smiles in my life as I did in Germany (to the point that I spent my last months in the country buying more beer for pub dwellers than I actually drank myself.) I was spoiled by the shorter time frames for services (eg.- when my movers were told to arrive between 0800-1000, they apologised for arriving at *0845*.), the attention given to detail for the production of various items, the “manageable” cost per labor business model (German bread and meat and milk, German housing and German transport have similar costs for production/utilisation as their American counterparts, but German manufacturers don’t gouge their consumers for every spare pfennig.)
I lived in 1/2 of a German house for two years, paying 650Euro/month (at the time, $900/month), for which I received two bedrooms/paid gas, heat, water, sewage and trash/free dinners from my landlord (as she felt that the actual homeowner was overcharging me for my tenancy). In comparison, I paid $650/month for a one bedroom apartment in an even more empty section of America, while paying close to $400/month for the amenities that were included in my prior apartment’s costs.
To elaborate: both living arrangements were procured in rapidly filling military towns. My German apartment retailed for 450Euro on the open market, but the owner “overcharged” me as compensation for English translation (earning me the necessary compensated utilities). In comparison, my American housing supplier, despite calling himself a “proud supporter of ‘the troops'”, saw fit to increase his rental property costs as soon as more Federal dollars began to pour into the area (then increased costs again as soon as the oil companies began surveying the area, for a two year increase from $500/month in 2007, to $675/month in 2008 after my arrival, to $900/month in 2009.) Adding insult to injury, the German town was full to capacity when I arrived, yet they made an effort to treat all but the most drunken and obnoxious/criminal troops with respect. In comparison, the American town, despite its abundance of housing, made no bones about creating a “that’s the ‘bad’ part of town” price manipulation campaign to justify the rise in housing costs (to wit, this part of the country is 95% white, has no Mexicans and its closest rez is over two hours away. As a military town, its “undesirables” are the less than 10% of its population that are retired {low ranking} military, less than 100 trailer-park-dwelling (but still very low crime) hanger-ons, and a semi-nomadic group of less than 1000 migrant workers. Despite the fact that the majority of the trailer dwellers and able-bodied retirees soon returned to employment as the petrol dollars began to flow, their prior status was enough to tar them with the dalit/eta/”n****r” brush. On top of that, I knew all 12 of the black, non-AD people who lived there, all of whom were well-pensioned military retirees. But, to make more profit, they became the equivalent of the gold-toothed, handgun-waving rap caricatures in the MSM.)
But, back on track, I noticed that Germans would rather get as much work done (competently) in a short time, than Americans (and, for that matter, the British.) German plumbers and electricians finish their jobs in less than an hour, then ready themselves for the next job; their Anglo equivalents tend to dither (unless they’re either working in a high-volume urban area or are the “only game in town”.) A German home can have a hot tub or sauna installed/a greenhouse or solarium built/a deck added on in less than a week, whereas all American homeowners know of the pain of working with contractors. Same day photography services existed in Germany for decades prior to our American “Fotomats”. What an urban American considers to be “artisanal” foods (handmade bread or candy, for example), is de riguer in rural Germany (and German bread is ready at 0500.) New York City’s new generation of “homestyle” bakers and butchers are never open for business before 0800 (and those early risers are almost always in family-owned businesses. Entrepreneurial first-generation European-copiers are never open before 0900 in NYC.)
And, to keep everything flowing, Germans work within those guidelines for service. Unlike Americans, I’ve never heard of rural Germans droning on about having to *wait* to get things done (its understood that there are only so many hands available, so they’d better be ready to get things accomplished at sunrise.) Unlike Americans, rural Germans seem to embrace the idea that the distasteful nature of a job is no reason to denigrate or slander its performer (the neighbourhood plumber and electrician families in my area were called “Stinky” and “Sizzle”, but I *never* heard or saw them treated any worse than the local politicians or newspaper people. Hell, I was called “Herr Dunkel” {Mr. Dark} for my time in the town, but I never received bad service/no service from *anyone*. **Ever**. In fact, my heartiest defenders were “former” neo-Nazis. On two separate occasions, bartenders shooed away or rejected “those types” when I was in their pubs.)
(Note: although there are exceptions to every rule, these are general depictions of the average.)
Finally, unlike Americans, rural Germans would rather be comfortable than rich (IME); a German heater repairman would rather do 6 jobs in 6 hours of work in one day for 50Euro/hour than 3 jobs in 9 hours of work in one day with a €450 take home (I found my Euro symbol!) A worker in rural Germany who’s earning €20/hour might take home €100/day after taxes, but he’s happy because his monthly lodging expenses are under €750/month. A rural/suburban American worker who’s earning $20/hour can take home $150/day after taxes, every single day, yet feels that he’s underpaid (even though he’s living rent-free at home and less than 25% of his money is taken in taxes, “that other guy over there” is driving around a 2009 car and he’s still riding in a 2006 car.) The €100/day worker puts €50/day aside for rent and utilities/train fare (to let’s say…, 2 Fussball matches in Köln), but he’s happy because he can enjoy 3 meals, 2 snacks, 6 beers and keep an extra €20 per day in the bank towards Karneval, Weihnachtsferien, Geburtstag, etc. The same American guy is buying things that he will rarely/never use to keep up with the Joneses. With the exception of the heavy-lifting workers, all of the Germans who I knew were into the 3 medium-sized meals, 3 small snack diets (if there’s any visible remnant of Germany’s contributions to America, I’d say that its based on their sandwich/sausage culture. You can’t throw a rock in NYC without hitting a deli or hot dog cart, just as Germans have their light-meal Imbissen snack shops.) In comparison, if you visit any section of America that’s still profitable, you’ll see that even the most sedentary of workers eats meals that German *farmers* would find suitable (best example that comes to mind: male nurse, rural North Dakota, all of his patients are mobile.
Breakfast-3 eggs, 1/2 lb of bacon, 4 sausages, 4 slices of bread, hash browns.
10 AM snack-family-sized bag of Doritos
Lunch-1 lb burger(1-2 patties as needed), 2 orders of large fries, 1 order of onion rings
3 PM snack-sub sandwich, *not* Subway or Quizno’s-sized, but like Dagwood-sized.
Dinner-20-oz. porterhouse steak, 2 baked potatoes (loaded), beans, maybe some spinach
I’ll note that this man ate like this *every day*, despite the fact that he had orderlies for heavy lifting and spent 5-6 hours a day sitting behind a desk. He consumed more calories in his breakfast and dinner than I ever witnessed his German equivalent (in training and workload) eating in a *day*. This is no exaggeration, his biggest meals of the day often totalled about or over 3,000 calorie totals. I ate less than him per day during my time in BMT, when I spent 4+ hours a day marching and 2 hours a day exercising. And seeing as how this nurse couldn’t cook, he was spending close to $40/day for his eating habits (never mind the six pack or six drafts of beer as soon as he left work.) Then, of course, he had the nerve to complain about his inability to hold on to money. In comparison, the nurse/translator with whom I worked ate…
Breakfast: cereal, dried apple, coffee
Morning snack: 2 pieces of fruit, or 4 more pieces of dried fruit, usually apricots.
Lunch: roast turkey breast, hash browns, broccoli
Afternoon snack: 2 small ham and cheese sandwiches
Dinner: wheat pasta with meatballs, salad
German guy: “Why would drinking beer make me fat, Herr Dunkel?”
American guy:”Why the f*ck am I getting so fat!? Maybe I should drink two beers less every day?”
In summation: (rural) German workplace culture rules, Anglo workplace culture drools.
If we as Americans put more regard into *doing good and necessarywork* than *looking busy while stretching things out* , we’d be able to enjoy 3-day weekends every month as well. It’s a damnable shame that Germans complain about their ‘inefficient” government (because it takes three days for an American-conceived and Germany-born child to have his or her name removed from German citizenship rolls), while Americans crow about improvements on our end (because it “used to” take 3 months to relinquish German citizenship for our overseas-born children, but now “it only takes two weeks, if we make sure that the child is born on a base, and both of its parents are American-born, and that child doesn’t need to receive any medical treatment outside of the base, and…”)
Will S.
April 6, 2012 at 6:30 pm
@ MaMu1977: Interesting testimonial; thanks!
Svar
April 6, 2012 at 9:48 pm
@ MaMu1977
Thanks for the comment, it was very enlightening. I’ve long realized that the American Dream was full of shit and this country is going downhill fast; I don’t have deep roots in this country any way so it is easier for me to go up and out.
Then again… Cylde Wilson has mentioned two of his acquaintances who left America back in the 60’s because they couldn’t stand how the country was going to hell… One left to the Falkland Islands and one left to South Africa(HAH!). I feel bad for the latter guy; he really, really got screwed. SA went to the dogs in 1994 while America is still not complete shit(key word being complete) as of 2012.